From: Lovstrand@EuroPARC.Xerox.COM (Lennart Lovstrand) Subject: Re: 'cut' Date: 1 Aug 91 10:21:34 GMT References: <3121@pdxgate.UUCP> Sender: news@parc.xerox.com In article <3121@pdxgate.UUCP> a0cb@.cc.pdx.edu (Chris Bertholf) writes: > In article <17303@life.ai.mit.edu> djh@gnu.ai.mit.edu (danny) writes: > >does anyone know where i could get the src or > >if there's an equivalent program (aside from sed)... > > Cut is a System V utility. Not surprising that you can't find it. There is > a BSD utility called 'colrm' for removing specified colums. You might try > that instead of cut until you can get the sources. You can get "cut" from the GNU fileutils package by anonymous ftp to prep.ai.mit.edu. See pub/gnu/fileutils-2.1.tar.Z. Please folks, try to somehow move over to the new comp.sys.next.xxx newsgroups. Do whatever necessary; bribe, threaten, or take your local sysadmin for a joyride on your NeXTmobile to make them available if they aren't already. -- --Lennart Rank Xerox EuroPARC, 61 Regent St, Cambridge, CB2 1AB, UK. ``The first thing we do let's kill all the lawyers.'' [Hamlet, The First Part of the Contention, 4.2, line 78] From: shei@bogie.cs.indiana.edu (Shing Shong Shei) Subject: Re: Problems compiling Perl Date: 1 Aug 91 14:09:57 GMT References: <1991Jul31.193036.24539@news.cs.indiana.edu> In article cedman@golem.ps.uci.edu (Carl Edman) writes: > >This problem has nothing to do with the optimizer. It is with libnm.a > >which is included by default by Configure. Just run Configure again, > >and remove libnm.a. That will produce a perl which compiles and > >self-tests just fine. > > No, I don't think so. I did encounter the error message about the libnm.a > as described in the first message. I ranlib it and it did complain about > not symbol table. Still I went ahead and link it, the generated perl was > okay, i.e., it passed "make test". > >Why do you disagree ? We are saying exactly the same thing. Whether >you link by ignoring the libnm.a error messages or properly >reconfigure perl using Configure not to link libnm.a in at all does >not make the slightest difference. Sorry that I didn't make it clear. Yes, Carl was right that this has nothing to do with the optimizer. But there is a small difference in removing or not removing libnm.a. I didn't look into if taking out the libnm reduces some functionalities of perl or not. But "make test" sure doesn't test ALL functionalities of perl. In installing this version (4.010), at some stage, I got a version that passed "make test" but when I installed it to the system, some of the perl scripts failed to work. Anyway, the following script shows that perl does link with libnm.a. First, use "cc -v" to see how cc call the ld to link the perl. Then try to link one by yourself except adding "-M" asking ld to generate a load map. ======= beldar: make CC="cc -v" cc -v array.o cmd.o cons.o consarg.o doarg.o doio.o dolist.o dump.o eval.o form.o hash.o perl.o regcomp.o regexec.o stab.o str.o toke.o util.o perly.o usersub.o -lnm -ldbm -lm -o perl NeXT Release 2.0 (v31.1) -- GNU version 1.36 /bin/ld -o perl -lcrt0.o array.o cmd.o cons.o consarg.o doarg.o doio.o dolist.o dump.o eval.o form.o hash.o perl.o regcomp.o regexec.o stab.o str.o toke.o util.o perly.o usersub.o -lnm -ldbm -lm -lsys_s beldar: /bin/ld -M -o perl -lcrt0.o array.o cmd.o cons.o consarg.o doarg.o doio.o dolist.o dump.o eval.o form.o hash.o perl.o regcomp.o regexec.o stab.o str.o toke.o util.o perly.o usersub.o -lnm -ldbm -lm -lsys_s > /tmp/map ======= Scan through the map, you will see: ======= Load map for: perl Segment name Section name Address Size __PAGEZERO 0x00000000 0x00002000 __TEXT 0x00002000 0x00030000 __TEXT __text 0x00003a7c 0x00029480 0x00003a7c 0x000000a4 /lib/crt0.o 0x00003b20 0x00000514 array.o 0x00004034 0x000019fc cmd.o 0x00005a30 0x000020a4 cons.o 0x00007ad4 0x00002458 consarg.o 0x00009f2c 0x00002b24 doarg.o 0x0000ca50 0x00003c38 doio.o 0x00010688 0x00003274 dolist.o 0x000138fc 0x00006618 eval.o 0x00019f14 0x00000bd4 form.o 0x0001aae8 0x000009f0 hash.o 0x0001b4d8 0x000020e8 perl.o 0x0001d5c0 0x00001568 regcomp.o 0x0001eb28 0x00001034 regexec.o 0x0001fb5c 0x00001af0 stab.o 0x0002164c 0x00001f2c str.o 0x00023578 0x00006590 toke.o 0x00029b08 0x00000ed8 util.o 0x0002a9e0 0x00001df4 perly.o 0x0002c7d4 0x0000000c usersub.o 0x0002c7e0 0x00000050 /usr/lib/libnm.a(trig.o) 0x0002c830 0x000002a4 /usr/lib/libnm.a(atan2.o) 0x0002cad4 0x000002f4 /usr/lib/libnm.a(pow.o) 0x0002cdc8 0x00000034 /usr/lib/libnm.a(exp.o) 0x0002cdfc 0x0000002c /usr/lib/libnm.a(log.o) 0x0002ce28 0x0000002c /usr/lib/libnm.a(sqrt.o) 0x0002ce54 0x000000a8 /usr/lib/libnm.a(support.o) ... 0x0002f994 0x00000038 /usr/lib/libnm.a(atan2.o) 0x0002f9cc 0x00000028 /usr/lib/libnm.a(pow.o) __TEXT __cstring 0x0002f9f4 0x0000260a ... ====== From: slp@genrad.uucp (Stephen L. Peters) Subject: Re: NeXT groups Date: 1 Aug 91 11:55:13 GMT References: <941@equinox.unr.edu> <907@daily-planet.concordia.ca> Sender: news@genrad.UUCP In article <907@daily-planet.concordia.ca> stefanos@concour.cs.concordia.ca (KIAKAS stefanos) writes: >the new groups are: > > comp.sys.next.misc > comp.sys.next.announce > comp.sys.next.programer (maybe 2 m's) > comp.sys.next.sysadmin > >hope this helps Yes, it's with 2 m's -- comp.sys.next.programmer Now, all of you, shoo! Shoo shoo shoo! Go join comp.sys.next.misc -- you've already missed the two major flame wars this season -- one against NewsGrazer, the next against sef@kithrup.com Don't miss whatever the next battle is about to be! Stephen Peters From: weinri@athena.cs.uga.edu (Kevin Weinrich) Subject: Can't boot Summary: Just received used system, "Exception #2" on boot, help Date: 1 Aug 91 15:41:29 GMT Expires: References: Sender:weinri@athena.cs.uga.edu Keywords: We just had a cube "donated" (it's a long story) to us. I'm trying to get in touch with the donors, but in the meantime maybe one of you kind souls have seen this before (I've never used a NeXT before, I'm a Sun sysadmin): On boot, I see "Testing system" and "Loading from disk" with the appropriate graphic. Within a second of the graphic starting to "spin", I enter the ROM Monitor (2.2 (v63)) and get : Exception #2 (0x8) at 0x4380012 and the Monitor prompt. With the Optical Cart. (Software Release 2.0) loaded, I try "bod test". Same result. I can't find anything about "Exceptions" in the few manuals it came with. Could this be due to a problem in shipping. I greatly appreciate any tips. Replies to weinri@athena.cs.uga.edu would be most welcome. I will try to get our sysadmin to add the new newsgroups, but they're not available yet, or I would have asked there. -Kevin Weinrich From: malkin@ksr.com (Alexander Malkin) Subject: Perl on NeXT? Date: 1 Aug 91 20:58:38 GMT Sender: news@ksr.com This is probably in a FAQ, but could someone tell me where to get Perl for the NeXT? Thanks. Alex (malkin@ksr.com or uunet!ksr!malkin) From: johnr%oceania@UUNET.UU.NET (John Robison) Subject: The new groups Date: 1 Aug 91 22:09:20 GMT Sender: johnr@oceania.UUCP (John Robison) OK all, forward this to your sysadmins to get the new groups. This is from news.announce.newgroups. [irrelevant stuff deleted] The following USENET groups have been created in the past month: GROUP ADD DATE NOTES ============================================================================== comp.sys.next.announce 7 Jul moderated, csn-announce@media.mit.edu comp.sys.next.misc 7 Jul comp.sys.next.programmer 7 Jul comp.sys.next.sysadmin 7 Jul John From: cdl@chiton.ucsd.edu (Carl Lowenstein) Subject: Re: 'cut' Date: 1 Aug 91 14:52:33 GMT References: <17303@life.ai.mit.edu> In article <17303@life.ai.mit.edu> djh@gnu.ai.mit.edu (danny) writes: >hi! >i can seem to find this program in 2.0... > >does anyone know where i could get the src or >if there's an equivalent program (aside from sed)... A public-domain replacement has been around for quite a while. Look in (e.g.) gatekeeper.dec.com:pub/comp.sources.unix/volume8/cut+paste.Z Also ftp.uu.net:ftp/bsd-sources/usr.bin/cut " " paste Also wuarchive.wustl.edu:unix/4.3bsd-reno/usr.bin/cut " " paste Figuring that if you need cut, paste can't be far behind. From: nk@home.sybase.com Subject: Portable NeXTs... (Suggestion) Keywords: portable computers Date: 31 Jul 91 17:40:20 GMT Sender: news@Sybase.COM I was giving my officemate a demo of my NeXT box and it hit me that a portable version of the NeXT box would be really slick. Are there any plans for a portable NeXT box/slab? Here are some features it I think it should have: Half-height-drives (maybe 2 of them, 300Mb if possible) Size no larger than 9''x11''x2'' (able to fit into a briefcase easily) High-resolution mono-monitor. (???) Ability to sense ethernet and phone connections and appropriately mount or unmount filesystems, or start or stop uucp transmissions. Pause feature. (the machine can be "turned-off" and then back on without loss of machine state. Saves rebooting time.) Cellular modem (with proper error handling would be a plus, 9600 would be nice). Mouse/Track-ball options. What do you think? Nicolai Kosche nk@sybase.com {pyramid,sun,mtxinu}!sybase!nk I speak only for myself and I do not reflect the views or position of Sybase. Anything included in this message is provided at your own risk. From: toon@news.sara.nl Subject: Re: The new groups - hand made ? Why ? Date: 2 Aug 91 06:46:16 GMT References: <1991Aug1.220920.13565@oceania.UUCP> In article <1991Aug1.220920.13565@oceania.UUCP>, johnr%oceania@UUNET.UU.NET (John Robison) writes: > OK all, forward this to your sysadmins > to get the new groups. This is from > news.announce.newgroups. > > [irrelevant stuff deleted] > > The following USENET groups have been created in the past month: [... follow the well known four new groups ...] Why, in all the world, do these sites need human assistance for creating new (and approved) newsgroups ? I had 'm the day after they were announced because our news software (ANU-NEWS 6.0-3 on VMS) supports automatic execution of control messages. I am THE news manager for SARA.NL and I'm sure glad I don't have to deal with this kind of details myself (why do we have computers, anyway, if we can't automate laborious, tedious and unrewarding - oh, well, not in this special case, of course .-) - tasks). This way I am also sure that the rmgroup message that removes this newsgroup on the 2nd of September will execute without my intervention (see note below .-) From: cedman@golem.ps.uci.edu (Carl Edman) Subject: Re: Problems compiling Perl Date: 2 Aug 91 15:19:00 GMT References: <1991Jul31.193036.24539@news.cs.indiana.edu> <1991Aug1.091003.1257@news.cs.indiana.edu> Nntp-Posting-Host: 714-856-8134.nts.uci.edu In-reply-to: shei@bogie.cs.indiana.edu's message of 1 Aug 91 14:09:57 GMT Now I see your point. (Sorry, I thought you made the same point a several people have made in letters to me that a) they can't "rm libnm.a" because their sysadmin won't allow it or b) they can't find libnm.a anywhere in the makefiles or the Configure script (it is everywhere as -lnm)). On the other hand clearly all the routines in libnm.a are also in libm.a. I could not find any description of it anywhere in the extended or developers documentation. What _does_ libnm.a do over libm.a ? Carl Edman -- Please do send mail to me at . The local sendmail might be broken and until it is fixed the above address guarantees that I get at least one copy. Thank you. From: cedman@golem.ps.uci.edu (Carl Edman) Subject: Re: Perl on NeXT? Date: 2 Aug 91 15:23:51 GMT References: <4864@ksr.com> Nntp-Posting-Host: 714-856-8134.nts.uci.edu In-reply-to: malkin@ksr.com's message of 1 Aug 91 20:58:38 GMT In article <4864@ksr.com> malkin@ksr.com (Alexander Malkin) writes: This is probably in a FAQ, but could someone tell me where to get Perl for the NeXT? Get the source from any of the standard sites (e.g. prep.ai.mit.edu) via anon ftp. Run the Configure script. It will recognize a NeXT computer and give you almost all the defaults you want. The only exception is the line in which you are asked for the libraries to use. There are some problems with libnm.a (the -lnm switch). The easiest solution is to simply remove that switch (just give "-ldbm -lm" when querried instead of the default of "-lnm -ldbm -lm"). After that perl should have a few minor warnings during compilation but work without problems. Carl Edman -- Please do send mail to me at . The local sendmail might be broken and until it is fixed the above address guarantees that I get at least one copy. Thank you. From: philip@pescadero.Stanford.EDU (Philip Machanick) Subject: Need help in buying decision Date: 2 Aug 91 17:04:15 GMT Sender: news@neon.Stanford.EDU (USENET News System) I'm a bit puzzled by the New NeXT's in November thread, where there seems to be doubt that NeXT will be using the 88K. There is an article in the San Francisco afternoon paper (Examiner? Chronicle? - bad memory for names) quoting Jobs as saying the 88K would blow away the MIPS R4000, as if everyone knew they were going to use it [1 August, business section]. In any case: is someone from NeXT prepared to give details of short-term product plans to help me decide whether to go for NeXT? Please don't tell me all the advantages of NeXT over other platforms - I know that already. (I haven't read this group for a while, so I may have missed something.) From: delphys@ocean.cc.mcgill.ca (David HOLMES) Subject: Re: 'cut' Date: 2 Aug 91 16:50:18 GMT References: <17303@life.ai.mit.edu> Sender: news@cs.mcgill.ca (Netnews Administrator) In article <17303@life.ai.mit.edu> djh@gnu.ai.mit.edu (danny) writes: > hi! > i can seem to find this program in 2.0... > > does anyone know where i could get the src or > if there's an equivalent program (aside from sed)... We had the same problem with some backup scripts. You can find the compressed binaries on our ftp site archive.CC.McGill.CA as src/user-tools/cutBSD-4-NeXTs.Z src/user-tools/pasteBSD-4-NeXTs.Z ________ __________________________ __ David Holmes McGILL UNIVERSITY UNIX Support Group - Computing Centre Montreal, CANADA email delphys@CC.McGill.CA voice 514-398-3716 delphys@MCGILL1.BITNET FAX 514-398-6876 NeXT email delphys@ocean.CC.McGill.CA ----------------------------------------------------------------- From: gemoe@proximus.north.de (Gerhard Moeller) Subject: Re: 'cut' Date: 2 Aug 91 07:24:55 GMT References: <17303@life.ai.mit.edu> Sender: gemoe@proximus.north.de In article <17303@life.ai.mit.edu> djh@gnu.ai.mit.edu (danny) writes: > hi! > i can seem to find this program in 2.0... > > does anyone know where i could get the src or > if there's an equivalent program (aside from sed)... > > i just started using a NeXTstation and was used to using > /usr/bin/cut in my scripts that i carried over from SunOS. > > danny 'cut' is licenced by ATT (which is a modem-test-command). But you can get gcut from gnu. You should (hopefully) find it at prep.ai.mit.edu somwhere in u2/... The file you need is, I think, fileutils1.4. But if you can't find it and you can receive NeXT Mail, I'll send you mine. (Just tell me if you want the source or the executable...I hope I still have the source somewhere... ;-) ) Fun, Gerhard. -- +---------------------------< principiis obsta! >---------------------------+ | Gerhard Moeller, Teichstrasse 12, 2900 Oldenburg (FRG) [Geb. 02/21/68] | | inhouse: gimli!gemoe NeXT: gemoe@proximus.north.de | |DOMAIN: Gerhard.Moeller@arbi.Informatik.Uni-Oldenburg.DE | |BITNET: gmoeller%arbi.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de@DOLUNI1 (106495@DOLUNI1) | +-----------------------> the medium is the message <-----------------------+ From: melling@cs.psu.edu (Michael D Mellinger) Subject: Re: New NeXT's in November? Date: 3 Aug 91 01:52:42 GMT References: <7305@ns-mx.uiowa.edu> <3120@pdxgate.UUCP> Sender: news@cs.psu.edu (Usenet) In article <3120@pdxgate.UUCP> a0cb@.cc.pdx.edu (Chris Bertholf) writes: Binary compatability with what. Almost every major manufacturer that has looked at the 88K has found it to be technologically deficient in several areas. Sure it's nice that Motorolla came out with a BCS, but since basically noone will be using it besides Motorolla and the few companies that sign on, it will be a very small customer base that can be targeted based on an 88K BCS. Incidentally, Intel, IBM, MIPS, SPARC, and most other RISCs also have binary compatability standards. Binary compatible with most every other NeXT!! That way people who set up networks of NeXTs don't have to play around with two different binaries. I'd agree that RISC is ONE OF the most promising technologies in the near future, but not Motorollas version of it. Their entire manufacturing facilities will have to be re-worked to support the manufacturing of the IBM POWER RISC chip, since it uses technology beyond that which Motorolla currently has. How do you expect them to compete with a RISC chipset that is inferior to the ones they will be producing for their competitors. Sabatoge IBM RISC? :-). Hire some smart people who know something about RISC? With Intel and IBM working on versions of their RISC processors that combine the best of RISC and VLIW technologies, and by the time that Motorolla gets up to speed, these other chips will be defacto standards with large installed customer bases and backwrad compatability with the first versions of their RISC-only processors. The 88K really is no more promising than the i860 is as a general purpose RISC chip. Admittedly, the i860 has more caveats than the Motorolla architecture, but the Motorolla is not doing much better. The current 88K is as fast or faster than the 68040, at least from the SPECmarks that I've seen. A lot will depend on NeXT. Will they ever sell 1 million machines a year? You might want to consider that Motorola might still have a little company pride, and they might not like the idea of making IBM's chips. Look at MIPS. They beat everyone in the microprocessor game. They're not exactly a large company. Betting your future on the 88K is almost as smart as betting it on the INMOS transputer. Neither one will probably get off the ground except in niche markets. This is 1991, the latter half of the 20th century. Switching microprocessors is only an inconvenience. It's not going to break every piece of software written for the NeXT(at least not significantly). By the fourth quarter of this year, IBM will have reduced the POWER architecture to a single chip implementation. Then they will start producing chips with more than a 25 MHz clock speed, and watch those SPECmarks jump. Motorolla, on the other hand, will still be working the bugs out of the 2 chip implementation of the 88K... Not a promising chip to bet your future on... You might be right. What's up with the 88110? Is it 60 mips or 100mips? NeXT might be better of going with the MIPS R3000, R4000(R6000...) chips. ACE(Microsoft/DEC/Compaq/MIPS) adopting these chips means that they will be *cheap*, and they're second sourced, unlike Motorola's chips. -Mike From: theo@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (theodore teoh choon sun) Subject: Cube for sale Date: 5 Aug 91 06:41:31 GMT Sender: news@ut-emx.uucp I have an 030 NeXT Cube for sale. The configurations are: 40 MB internal harddisk(for swapping) 8 MB RAM 1 Optical Drive 2 Optical disks (System 1.0 & 2.1) 1 2400bps modem I am asking for $3200.00 or best offer. I will share half the cost of shipping and handling. Interested party please e-mail to theo@doc.cc.utexas.ed From: dbg@sinix.UUCP (David George) Subject: Re: IBM-APPLE Merger Date: 5 Aug 91 14:17:19 GMT References: <3072@pdxgate.UUCP> <1991Jul23.232350.7221@math.ucla.edu> <1991Jul24.171310.29463@potomac.ads.com> In the August Edition of Personal Computer World they announced that the Apple-IBM deal was off for the forseable future, of course that may be a short time as this magazine claimed in 1987 that "OS2 will be to DOS what DOS was to CP/M". David. ref: Personal Computer World, U.K., Aug 1991, West Coast Feature. From: kenyee@ksr.com (Ken Yee) Subject: Portable code (GUI and otherwise) Date: 5 Aug 91 13:31:46 GMT Sender: news@ksr.com A couple of neophyte programming questions about programming the NeXT GUI: 1) Does g++ exist for the NeXT? I've heard rumors that it did. If it did, this would solve the non-portability of Objective-C programs to C++. 2) Does anyone make class libraries which are retargettable to MS-Windows, the Mac, X-windows, Motif, as well as NeXT?. I'd like to be able to take the same code and port it to different systems by just linking with different libraries; I've heard that XVT provides this functionality for MS-Windows, Mac, and X-windows... Ken (kenyee@ksr.com or uunet!ksr!kenyee) From: a0cb@.cc.pdx.edu (Chris Bertholf) Subject: Re: New NeXT's in November? Date: 5 Aug 91 17:46:06 GMT References: <7305@ns-mx.uiowa.edu: Sender: news@cs.psu.edu (Usenet) In article <3160@pdxgate.UUCP> a0cb@.cc.pdx.edu (Chris Bertholf) writes: Try to tell VARs and secondary software developers this. Especially if they have tuned their application(s) to the current hardware. Sure, it is 1991, but it is not as easy as you would like to believe or have the rest of us believe. At least it will be easier for them to PORT to the new hardware and software, given the NeXT development environment, but it will NOT be trivial. It sounds like you have never done a major port! How are developers tuning their apps for the 68040? NeXT has some work to do, but most developers don't have much work at all! They can build 68040 and 88K (or any other chip) binaries from a single source. Possibly the same source they're using today. -Mike From: bob@MorningStar.Com (Bob Sutterfield) Subject: Re: New NeXT's in November? Date: 5 Aug 91 21:42:17 GMT References: <7305@ns-mx.uiowa.edu: Sender: news@MorningStar.Com In article melling@cs.psu.edu (Michael D Mellinger) writes: In article <3160@pdxgate.UUCP> a0cb@.cc.pdx.edu (Chris Bertholf) writes: ...Especially if [VARs and secondary software developers] have tuned their application(s) to the current hardware. How are developers tuning their apps for the 68040? Usually without much effort at all. It's very easy to write code that runs well on one type of processor architecture. The hard work comes in writing very portable code without any assumptions about the underlying iron. NeXT has some work to do, but most developers don't have much work at all! It depends upon how much work the developers did up front to make their code portable. If they're experienced in writing code to run on a variety of processors, then their code is probably already most of the way there. If they have only worked on one or two types of machines, then they may discover a lot of hidden assumptions. Not to sound snooty or anything, but how many NeXT developers came "up" from (e.g.) Macintoshes, and how many came "down" from other UNIX systems? The former group has been living in a sheltered, forcibly homogenous world, where the biggest shock in recorded history was the introduction of Color QuickDraw and 32-bit addressing, which wouldn't have bothered any of them if they had been writing portable code in the first place. The latter group has seen it all before, and will have a much easier time of it. They can build 68040 and 88K (or any other chip) binaries from a single source. Possibly the same source they're using today. Yes, they can, if the code is well written. But the toughest time in any UNIX code's life cycle is typically its first port to a RISC architecture. I've ported "super-portable" code that was written on a VAX to a Sun-1 and a Sun-2 and a Pyramid, and from a Sun-1 to a Sun-2 to a Sun-3 to a Sun-4, and from several other things to 88K and MIPS and IBM RTs and RS/6000s. It's uniformly harder to move from a CISC machine to a RISC machine, because the RISC machines are uniformly pickier. If the author isn't careful about the original assumptions about (e.g.) byte ordering and structure packing and array index incrementing efficiency (row vs column), it can sometimes be easier to pitch the code and rewrite it all from the specs. If they still exist. From: a0cb@.cc.pdx.edu (Chris Bertholf) Subject: Re: New NeXT's in November? Date: 5 Aug 91 22:11:53 GMT References: <7305@ns-mx.uiowa.edu: Sender: news@pdxgate.UUCP In article you write: > >In article <3160@pdxgate.UUCP> a0cb@.cc.pdx.edu (Chris Bertholf) writes: > > Try to tell VARs and secondary software developers this. Especially if > they have tuned their application(s) to the current hardware. Sure, it > is 1991, but it is not as easy as you would like to believe or have the > rest of us believe. At least it will be easier for them to PORT to the > new hardware and software, given the NeXT development environment, but > it will NOT be trivial. It sounds like you have never done a major port! > > >How are developers tuning their apps for the 68040? NeXT has some >work to do, but most developers don't have much work at all! They can >build 68040 and 88K (or any other chip) binaries from a single source. >Possibly the same source they're using today. In many cases this is true, but it is NOT true in many other cases. Have you ever ported a large application before? Have you ever written a large app before--One which REQUIRED the use of assembly level programming for time critical apps or specialized optimization? In my experience, even moving apps from one BSD 4.3 system to another BSD 4.3 system (both may be variants) are not always as simple and straight-forward as you imply. What if large portions of the optimized software I write is assembly for the 68040. I suppose you think that this would require a minor port to the 88K. I don't think so. Nor do many other independent software developers. Believe it or not, many time critical and specialy optimized pieces of code are STILL WRITTEN IN ASSEMBLY LANGUAGE. Of course if you have some special tool that will migrate 680x0 assembly to 88K assembly transparently and without programmer intervention, I think a lot of people might become real interested (if NeXT moves to an 88K platform). I'd be one of them. Chris __ / ) / / /_ __ o _ (__/ / /_/ (_<_/_)_ From: rgc@risky.med.jhu.edu (Ross G. Cutler) Subject: Re: New NeXT's in November? Date: 6 Aug 91 05:47:06 GMT References: <3160@pdxgate.UUCP> <3166@pdxgate.UUCP> Sender: rgc@risky.med.jhu.edu In article <3166@pdxgate.UUCP> a0cb@psuorpn.UUCP (Chris Bertholf) writes: [stuff deleted] >developers. Believe it or not, many time critical and specialy optimized >pieces of code are STILL WRITTEN IN ASSEMBLY LANGUAGE. Admittedly, some stuff is written in assembly for speed, but how many NeXTstep Apps are? That is the real question... My guess is that virtually none use assembly (except for some DSP stuff). In all of the NeXT PD source code that I've looked through in the archives, I haven't see one line of 68000 assembly code. NeXT doesn't want people to use assembly, and this is reflected in the total lack of documentation for as(1). Personally, I think this is a Good Thing, even though I use assembly myself (for hacks only). In summary, I don't foresee any big problems in porting large applications (e.g. Improv, WP, Diagram), since I doubt very much that any of these packages have any assembly code in them at all. Ross. NeXTstep: It not like your father's computing environment... From: lloyd@OTTO.UCC.UMASS.EDU (Lloyd) Subject: Re: DADiSP 2.01C Demo Date: 6 Aug 91 06:37:45 GMT Sender: daemon@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU GEEEE, was that ported from MS-DOS???? I would have NEVER guessed. *GAG* Chris lloyd@otto.ucc.umass.edu From: lloyd@OTTO.UCC.UMASS.EDU (Lloyd) Subject: 68k->88k Date: 6 Aug 91 02:42:27 GMT Sender: usenet@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU [ blah blah, all sorts of stuff about going to the 88k and porting] FINE, porting is no small task, thats not really the point, who cares if porting from VMS with little endian processor, diff compilers, diff libs etc etc to a Sun 3 is some work. The *point* is porting from 68k NeXT to 88K NeXT: 68k and 88k will have the same endianess (88k can be big or small) The OS will be the same. The libraries will be the same. The word size will be the same. The files will be in the same place. etc etc ETC ... The only data point really is anything that revolves around assembler, which is small to non-existant in *most* cases, fine, someone may have an entire app out there in 68k, they knew it would be unportable the minute they started it. I am currently writing some code which requires small little bits of asm for bitfield work, its isolated and uses gcc in-line assembler directives, it will take me about 15 minutes to port to the 88k. Big deal. I sincerely do not think there is all that much 68k assembler for the NeXT out there...if there is, I would be interested to hear from people, and how much they actually have to port and *why* they did it in assembler in the first place. Chris lloyd@otto.ucc.umass.edu From: kari@finn (Kari Karhi) Subject: Re: New NeXT's in November? Date: 6 Aug 91 14:14:59 GMT References: <1991Aug6.054706.21642@boingo.med.jhu.edu> Sender: usenet@pensoft.uucp (Usenet Psuedo User) In article <1991Aug6.054706.21642@boingo.med.jhu.edu> rgc@risky.med.jhu.edu (Ross G. Cutler) writes: > Admittedly, some stuff is written in assembly for speed, but > how many NeXTstep Apps are? That is the real question... My guess is co-Xist server uses some asm() calls that are mc680x0 specific. From: a0cb@.cc.pdx.edu (Chris Bertholf) Subject: Re: New NeXT's in November? Date: 6 Aug 91 18:07:06 GMT References: <3160@pdxgate.UUCP: [stuff deleted] In article <3175@pdxgate.UUCP> a0cb@psuorpn.UUCP (Chris Bertholf) writes: > >I seem to remember that EDIT and several other apps were written in assembly. >Just because you have not found any assembler in the marginally helpful, >generally small pieces of software on the archives does not mean that the >proprietary apps don't have them. How do you know Edit was written in Assembly? Did you see the source? It doesn't make any sense to me that it would be. In fact, if you type otool -v -o /NextApps/Edit you can see that there are lots of custom Obj-C files. I could not find any traces of *.s files in Edit; it is possible that some assembly was used... but I highly doubt it. GCC is a very good compiler, and produces very good code. And since the NeXT is damn fast (as least as far as apps like Edit is concerned), why would any programmer taint his OOP code with assembly? Ross. From: a0cb@.cc.pdx.edu (Chris Bertholf) Subject: Re: New NeXT's in November? Date: 6 Aug 91 22:36:22 GMT References: <3166@pdxgate.UUCP: <1991Aug6.054706.21642@boingo.med.jhu.edu: <3175@pdxgate.UUCP> <1991Aug6.194330.28967@boingo.med.jhu.edu> Sender: news@pdxgate.UUCP In article <1991Aug6.194330.28967@boingo.med.jhu.edu> you write: >[stuff deleted] >In article <3175@pdxgate.UUCP> a0cb@psuorpn.UUCP (Chris Bertholf) writes: >> >>I seem to remember that EDIT and several other apps were written in assembly. >>Just because you have not found any assembler in the marginally helpful, >>generally small pieces of software on the archives does not mean that the >>proprietary apps don't have them. > >How do you know Edit was written in Assembly? Did you see the source? >It doesn't make any sense to me that it would be. In fact, if you type > > otool -v -o /NextApps/Edit > >you can see that there are lots of custom Obj-C files. I could not find any >traces of *.s files in Edit; it is possible that some assembly was used... >but I highly doubt it. GCC is a very good compiler, and produces very good >code. And since the NeXT is damn fast (as least as far as apps like Edit is >concerned), why would any programmer taint his OOP code with assembly? Well, I might be wrong, but then the thread about EDIT originally being written in MOSTLY assembly that occurred in reference to another thread on comp.sys.next should have drawn a little more heat than it did... How do you know that large portions were not written in assembly? Did you see the source? Another Poster has pointed out that CoXist has several assembly hacks to get the job done... I was just pointing out one app that I heard had some major assembly work in it... I find it interesting that you say "taint", when most or all of the programmers and application developers I know tend to optimize and write time critical apps with combinations of C *AND* assembly. Have you ever written real time apps, time critical apps, or done your own optimization? (No, the -O option does not count) In addition, the argument about GCC producing tight code doesn't apply. GCC will have to be reworked to *EFFECTIVELY* support the 88K RISC processor. RISC is not CISC. The techniques for efficient compilers on a RISC box are very different than those for CISC boxes. The compiler has to make use of the pipelines and superscalar architecture of the RISC chip, in addition to the register allocation problems and the limitations of addressing memory directly versus through the cache. Why do you think IBM has a 37% improvement in SPECmarks without changing the clock speed of the RS/6000s, only the compilers were changed... BTW, IBM does not share all of its optimization techniques with the rest of the world--some are patented proprietary information that the GNU project will not have access to... RISC is only as good as the compilers that produce code for the RISC chip. Poor compiler technique can result in a RISC that has a phenomenal MIPS and MFLOPS rating, but can't outcompute an a 68K apple. Chris __ / ) / / /_ __ o _ (__/ / /_/ (_<_/_)_ From: rgc@risky.med.jhu.edu (Ross G. Cutler) Subject: Re: New NeXT's in November? Date: 7 Aug 91 00:17:50 GMT References: <3175@pdxgate.UUCP> <1991Aug6.194330.28967@boingo.med.jhu.edu> <3183@pdxgate.UUCP> In article <3183@pdxgate.UUCP> a0cb@psuorpn.UUCP (Chris Bertholf) writes: [stuff deleted] >Well, I might be wrong, but then the thread about EDIT originally being >written in MOSTLY assembly that occurred in reference to another thread >on comp.sys.next should have drawn a little more heat than it did... >How do you know that large portions were not written in assembly? >Did you see the source? Another Poster has pointed out that CoXist has >several assembly hacks to get the job done... I was just pointing out one >app that I heard had some major assembly work in it... > >I find it interesting that you say "taint", when most or all of the >programmers and application developers I know tend to optimize and >write time critical apps with combinations of C *AND* assembly. Have >you ever written real time apps, time critical apps, or done your >own optimization? (No, the -O option does not count) > >In addition, the argument about GCC producing tight code doesn't apply. >GCC will have to be reworked to *EFFECTIVELY* support the 88K RISC >processor. RISC is not CISC. The techniques for efficient compilers >on a RISC box are very different than those for CISC boxes. The >compiler has to make use of the pipelines and superscalar architecture >of the RISC chip, in addition to the register allocation problems >and the limitations of addressing memory directly versus through >the cache. Why do you think IBM has a 37% improvement in SPECmarks >without changing the clock speed of the RS/6000s, only the compilers >were changed... BTW, IBM does not share all of its optimization >techniques with the rest of the world--some are patented proprietary >information that the GNU project will not have access to... > >RISC is only as good as the compilers that produce code for the RISC >chip. Poor compiler technique can result in a RISC that has a phenomenal >MIPS and MFLOPS rating, but can't outcompute an a 68K apple. Sure, I've done lots of 286 assembly work with C, including realtime work. I even wrote an entire Core-like graphics library in assembly for C, because speed was of the utmost importance. But that was then, on on relatively slow computers...now we have Objective-C and a relatively fast computer. You don't *need* assembly for applications like Improv or Adobe Illustrator. And the NeXT *isn't* realtime (we still use PCs for that...). I said "taint" because OOP is very *high* level, and assembly is very *low* level. You say you program in "C and assembly"; currently, I do most of my programming in Objective-C (or C++). OOP is what the NeXT is about. Assembly isn't. That's why it isn't supported at *all*. Finally, GCC is available on at least two RISC computers, namely the Sun SPARCstations (SPARC CPU) and the DEC DECstations (MIPS R2/3000). It might be availably for the PS/6000 and Snakes too. So NeXT is not starting from scratch (i.e. your CISC != RISC statement isn't very relavent). Ross. From: sef@kithrup.COM (Sean Eric Fagan) Subject: Re: New NeXT's in November? Date: 7 Aug 91 00:11:18 GMT References: <3175@pdxgate.UUCP> <1991Aug6.194330.28967@boingo.med.jhu.edu> <3183@pdxgate.UUCP> In article <3183@pdxgate.UUCP> a0cb@psuorpn.UUCP (Chris Bertholf) writes: >In addition, the argument about GCC producing tight code doesn't apply. >GCC will have to be reworked to *EFFECTIVELY* support the 88K RISC >processor. It already has been. Gcc-2 (still in alpha, "Soon" to be beta) has a lot of features to work well on a RISC machine, including the 88k. >RISC is not CISC. The techniques for efficient compilers >on a RISC box are very different than those for CISC boxes. Not much. That's one of the interesting things about CISC vs. RISC: someone once made a compiler only use the "simple" instructions on a VAX (including simple addressing modes), and benchmarked the output with the output of the unmodified compiler. Result: the RISC-based approach was faster. (I really wish I could remember where this was; I'm pretty sure it was in a UseNIX paper within the past two or three years.) Code generation that produces fast code on a '40 is going to pretty much do the same thing on an 88k (remember that the complex addressing modes on the '40 are slower than the "simple" ones). >BTW, IBM does not share all of its optimization >techniques with the rest of the world--some are patented proprietary >information that the GNU project will not have access to... Uhm, most of the stuff IBM is doing is pretty obvious to people writing compilers. As I said, gcc-2 is no slouch on RISC machines (I've been told that it outperforms most other compilers for the Sparc, including Sun's; I don't have any figures, though, so that's just anecdotal). >RISC is only as good as the compilers that produce code for the RISC >chip. So is a CISC chip. Sheesh. From: melling@cs.psu.edu (Michael D Mellinger) Subject: Re: New NeXT's in November? Date: 7 Aug 91 01:30:48 GMT References: <3166@pdxgate.UUCP: <1991Aug6.054706.21642@boingo.med.jhu.edu: <3175@pdxgate.UUCP> <1991Aug6.194330.28967@boingo.med.jhu.edu> <3183@pdxgate.UUCP> Sender: news@cs.psu.edu (Usenet) In-Reply-To: a0cb@.cc.pdx.edu's message of 6 Aug 91 22: 36:22 GMT Nntp-Posting-Host: sunws0.sys.cs.psu.edu In article <3183@pdxgate.UUCP> a0cb@.cc.pdx.edu (Chris Bertholf) writes: In addition, the argument about GCC producing tight code doesn't apply. GCC will have to be reworked to *EFFECTIVELY* support the 88K RISC processor. RISC is not CISC. The techniques for efficient compilers on a RISC box are very different than those for CISC boxes. The compiler has to make use of the pipelines and superscalar architecture of the RISC chip, in addition to the register allocation problems and the limitations of addressing memory directly versus through the cache. Why do you think IBM has a 37% improvement in SPECmarks without changing the clock speed of the RS/6000s, only the compilers were changed... BTW, IBM does not share all of its optimization techniques with the rest of the world--some are patented proprietary information that the GNU project will not have access to... GNU GCC has already been ported to the 88K. Data General has been using it for quite some time. Compiler technology plays a *very* important role in RISC processors. RISC is only as good as the compilers that produce code for the RISC chip. Poor compiler technique can result in a RISC that has a phenomenal MIPS and MFLOPS rating, but can't outcompute an a 68K apple. We already know this. RISC isn't exactly new. There are just a few workstation vendors that haven't made the move to RISC yet. NeXT, and ... that's all I can think of. GCC 2.0 will be in out sometime in the next several months and it will include many improvements in the optimizer, especially ones for RISC processors. The FSF claims that it's as good (or comes close?) to Sun's commercial compiler for generating Sparc code. -Mike From: brian@beerwolf.umd.edu (Brian Cuthie) Subject: Re: Peripheral questions Date: 18 Aug 91 13:19:45 GMT References: <1774@endor.das.harvard.edu.harvard.edu> Sender: newspost@umbc3.umbc.edu (News posting account) In article <1774@endor.das.harvard.edu.harvard.edu> kochhar@das.harvard.edu (Sandeep Kochhar) writes: < Edited for television viewing > > I'm in the process of buying a NeXT machine (the basic 105M slab) for home > use, and I had a couple of questions about peripheral devices: > > 1. Can any SCSI external disk drive that I see in PC or MAC magazine be > used with a NeXT? > Do you have any recommendations (or "avoid this brand" advice) about > where I could get a decently priced drive (about 300-600 Megs)? > > 2. I also am looking at buying a Tape Drive both for Backups and for > transferring large amounts of data between the NeXT and a > Sun Sparcstation at work. The Sun Sparcstations that I have > access to use a Cartridge Tape Drive that, I think, uses a > format called "Quick 150". Anyone know where I could get a > tape drive for that (and approx prices...)? If that is a bad > choice, please let me know as well... > Whatever you do, these days, buy a DAT drive. The DDS standard (which is used in the DAT drives) is compatible accross drive manufacturers. What's nice about DAT is that you get 2 gig on a $10 tape with a transfer rate of 10M bytes/minute. The QIC (Quarter Inch Cartridge) drives are a little less expensive, but you will pay for it in time and tapes (they are about $20 - $30 each -- and you'll need more of them) over the long haul. I recommend the Archive DAT drive. It can be had from several mail order houses that list in the back of MacUser. It's not black but it is real nice. I got mine from APS (big ads in the back of MacUser and MacWorld) for about $1500. BTW: Avoid the scum company that is advertising in the back of MacUser and MacWorld. They claim to be a mail order house, *but* they have a 900 number instead of an 800 number. They want several dollars a minute to place an order by telephone *and* they want $10 (!!!) if you call their 900 FAX number! I believe the schmucks call themselves "Bottom Line". Obviously they're more concerned with *their* bottom line than yours... -Brian > Please reply by e-mail if possible. > > Thanks. > > Sandeep Kochhar From: ekouba@afit.af.mil (Eric T. Kouba) Subject: crash with writenow Date: 19 Aug 91 17:31:22 GMT I have a new 8/200 machine that has been giving me problems at random intervals. I have been using mainly WriteNow, so that is where the crashes occur. After creating a new document, or opening up a new one, and after some period of editing (with or without saves in between), I get a panic dialog box popping up. Something about invalid descriptor during table walk. I wrote down all of the relevent codes the last time it happened, but don't have it with me at the moment. From what I've heard, WriteNow is supposed to be a fairly hardy piece of software, so that leaves just the operating system. What kind of bug would pop up at random intervals like that? Thanks in advance. From: eboltz@jhunix.HCF.JHU.EDU (Eric Scott Boltz) Subject: NeXTCube For Sale Keywords: sale Date: 19 Aug 91 18:56:26 GMT **** POSTING FOR A FRIEND **** **** PLEASE DO NOT RESPOND **** **** TO THIS ACCOUNT **** Eric, Please post this for me. I am selling the following NeXT configuration. Original NeXTCube w/ megapixel display Upgraded to 68040 & version 2.1 of the OS 667 Megabyte Wren drive 256 Megabyte Optical drive w/ two cartridges 12 Megabytes of RAM This system is in exelent condition. Asking $7000 or best reasonable offer. Send inquires to ALANDAIL@applelink.apple.com From: simsong@nextworld.com (Simson L. Garfinkel) Subject: GNU source-code availability Date: 19 Aug 91 18:19:13 GMT Sender: simsong@NeXTWORLD.COM I just spoke with the appropriate people at NeXT. There have been numerous hold-ups and the company hopes to ship the floppy disks by October. (Groan). However, I'm working with them to see if I can get a copy sometime this week, which I will make available for FTP, once I get it. ................................................................simso n -- NewsGrazer, a NeXTstep(tm) news reader, posting -- M>UQR=&8P7&%NUQC;VQO#$V,#%<='@R,3,U7'1X,C8V.%QT M>#,R,#)<='@S-S,V7'1X-#(W,%QT>#0X,#-<='@U,S,W7&8P7&(P7&DP7'5L M,%QF2!D:7-K2!/8W1O8F5R+B`@*$=R;V%N*2X@(%P*7`I(;W=E=F5R+"!) M)VT@=V]R:VEN9R!W:71H('1H96T@=&\@ Sender: johnr@oceania.UUCP (John Robison) In article <1991Aug16.182822.370@wcraft.wimsey.bc.ca> Joseph Chin writes: > This is a test post. No one should be reading this news group anyways! > -- BZZZTT! WRONG!! This newsgroup is still being carried around the globe. People are still reading (and paying) for it. If you *MUST* play with posting, use the "to" group you should have created when you installed news. This group is specifically for local "testing". There is also a "local" for distribution, or you can post to misc.test or other groups specifically designed for testing you outgoing news functionality. Our "local" group is "to.oceania". Look for the local group and play there. "Testing" the capabilities of NewsGrazer to c.s.next is certainly something we can do without!!!! John From: muilu@finsun.csc.fi (Juha Muilu) Subject: software dealers in usa Date: 20 Aug 91 15:20:07 GMT Sender: usenet@nic.funet.fi Nntp-Posting-Host: finsun.csc.fi Hey, Could somebody send a fax number(s) of the good NeXT-software dealeri(s) in USA. Thanks. - Juha jmuilu@joyds3.joensuu.fi From: rnielsen@everest.com (Robert D. Nielsen) Subject: Employment for NeXT Developers Date: 20 Aug 91 17:26:00 GMT Sender: rnielsen@everest.com (Robert D. Nielsen) Everest Technology, Inc. is looking for three NeXT Developers. Everest is preparing to increasing its staff to meet the demands of a large consulting contract. These positions, which are full time and permanent, will require relocation to the Bay Area in October. The requirements are 3 years C development experience 2 years NeXTstep development experience Previous application development using the Sound Kit a plus. Oracle experience a plus Please respond via email. No calls please. -- Robert D. Nielsen Everest Technology, Inc. Palo Alto, California Voice (415) 326 2130 NeXTfax (415) 326 2131 NeXTmail rnielsen@everest.com From: tilley@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Richard Tilley) Subject: Re: crash with writenow Date: 20 Aug 91 20:48:44 GMT References: <1991Aug19.173122.3327@afit.af.mil> WriteNow craps often. Your Saves should be oftener :-) A case-insensative find for "the" in the "core" file using Edit can recover some data. Usually many copies. From: tms@twins.lanl.gov (Todd M. Swan) Subject: SimuLEARN Date: 21 Aug 91 15:56:33 GMT Sender: news@beta.lanl.gov (Usenet News) I have been reading through the Spring 1991 NeXT Software and Peripherals guide and I hav come across one of interest, SimuLEARN by Knowlege Transfer International. But when I call the number it is out of service. I called directory assistance and there is no listing. Has anyone heard of or dealt with this product or company or are they dead in the water? E-mail replies please... Todd -- ================================================================ ! PLEASE DEFINE: ! NeXT mail ! Todd M. Swan ! ! Ignorance ! replies are ! tms@twins.lanl.gov ! ! Apathy ! encouraged! ! Los Alamos National Lab ! =====================================! Los Alamos, NM ! ! I don't know and ! LANL is not responsible ! ! I don't care.... ! for my actions or words ! ================================================================ -- NewsGrazer, a NeXTstep(tm) news reader, posting -- M>UQR=&8P7&%N#,T-39<='@T-C`X7'1X-3#8Y M,3)<='@X,#8T7'1X.3(Q-EQT>#$P,S8X7'1X,3$U,C!<9C%<8C!<:3!<=6PP M7&9S,CA<9F,P($D@:&%V92!B965N(')E861I;F<@=&AR;W5G:"!T:&4@4W!R M:6YG(#$Y.3$@3F585"!3;V9T=V%R92!A;F0@4&5R:7!H97)A;',@9W5I9&4@ M86YD($D@:&%V(&-O;64@86-R;W-S(&]N92!O9B!I;G1E2!O2!D96%D(&EN('1H92!W871EUQ.1T=R87!H:6,S.#8@#(S,#1<='@S-#4V7'1X-#8P.%QT>#4W-C!<='@V.3$R7'1X M.#`V-%QT>#DR,39<='@Q,#,V.%QT>#$Q-3(P7&8Q7&(P7&DP7'5L,%QF Sender: usenet@quagga.ru.ac.za (Rhodes University NNTP server) In <1991Aug11.162744.28318@ms.uky.edu> raj@ms.uky.edu (Raj Yavatkar) writes: [Stuff deleted] > I am interested in porting Xview to Next machines and would >like to know whether anyone has already done it. As far as I know, you may get XNeXT.tar.Z via anon FTP from nova.cc.purdue.edu /pub/next/1.0-release/binaries/XNeXT.tar.Z I assume that the file system contains a binary file. I have not yet fetched the file because I do not have direct access to the NET. I would hate to think what would happen if I requested 8Mb with FTPMAIL. Could you let me know when you have successfully installed it? -------------------------------------------------------------- Taki Milionis milionis@odie.ee.wits.ac.za Network Manager milionis@nyquist.ee.wits.ac.za Electrical Engineering ------------------------------ Wits Univeristy From: guy@auspex.auspex.com (Guy Harris) Subject: Re: Xview on NeXt Keywords: X, Xview, SunView Date: 22 Aug 91 22:26:02 GMT References: <1991Aug11.162744.28318@ms.uky.edu> >> I am interested in porting Xview to Next machines ... > >As far as I know, you may get XNeXT.tar.Z via anon FTP ... Yes, but does it include XView, or is it just an X server and possibly "vanilla" X libraries? From: cpg@cs.utexas.edu (Carlos M. Puchol) Subject: XNeXT: what's wrong, X or NeXT ?, (or me :^) Summary: I can't install XNeXT in my station Keywords: XNeXT Date: 23 Aug 91 08:22:22 GMT (Sorry if this has been brought up before, I searched and didn't find anything) I have just installed the XNeXT release version 0.9.1 (MIT) on a 040 color station. No problems in the installation. But when I click in the dock (or in the file viewer,) I get no response. I launch it from the command line and I get the following message: (I typed the "dwrite" they tell in the instalation before this ...) > travis % XNeXT > can't open root window: WindowBitmap: Can't connect to server > screen 0 failed initialization > > Fatal server bug! > no screens found > > IOT trap > travis % I am running version 2.0 of the Operating System. When I try to run any binary Xapplication in the station, (even with DISPLAY set to a machine running X (R4)) I get: > X Toolkit Error: Can't Open display 0) I don't know much about X, but as I understand from the README file I think need to instal the X R3 server in the machine, is this right? 1) Do I need to have X (R3) running in my box to be able to diplay something run in the NeXT box in its display? 2) Do I need to have X (R3) running in a remote machine to be able to diplay something run in the NeXT box, in that remote machine's display? 3) I am quite confused because the documentation with this release of XNeXT is REALLY poor. Can anybody help me with this ? Thanks a bunch, Carlos Puchol Computer Sciences Department The University of Texas at Austin cpg@cs.utexas.edu (NeXT mail accepted :^) From: lacsap@plethora.media.mit.edu (Pascal Chesnais) Subject: Re: XNeXT: what's wrong, X or NeXT ?, (or me : ^) Date: 23 Aug 91 11:56:25 GMT References: <1838@saltillo.cs.utexas.edu> Sender: news@news.media.mit.edu (USENET News System) From the FAQ: There is a X11R3 version named XNeXT developed by MIT. This version is available in binary only, works only on monochrome machines and does not work under Release 2.0 of the NeXT OS. XNeXT is a 1-bit black and white server. XNeXT is available from most ftp sites that have NeXT software. --- I will send a note to the keepers of XNeXT to fix the readme. There is no plan to fix this server. Do not ask me for more info on X, I do not use it. pasc -- Pascal Chesnais, Research Specialist, Electronic Publishing Group Media Laboratory, E15-351, 20 Ames Street, Cambridge, Ma, 02139 (617) 253-0311 email: lacsap@plethora.media.mit.edu (NeXT) From: winkowsk@issun3.stc.nl (Daniel Winkowski) Subject: HyperMedia HW/SW Suggestions Needed Date: 23 Aug 91 06:26:16 GMT I am searching for suggestions on platforms and software products that meet the below requirements for a hypermedia authoring and display system. I would prefer commercial proven products but will also look at research and public domain software. In the below discussion the term slide/card is used to refer to the most primitive element of a presentation. Key: * Requirement + Nice to have Media Types: Importation from other sources ------------ * Text * Graphics (color preferred) + Video + Sound + Annimation Presentation: ------------- * Color Monitor * Projection system + TV Architecture: ------------- + Supports cooperative authoring over a network Organization/Control: --------------------- * Can impose a standard toplevel framework to a presentation * Can link a slide/card to others - "hyper like links" * Dialogs/Indicators may be added to provide user control of which link will be followed. * Can link a slide/card to a programatic routine for automatic updating (e.g. from a database, spreadsheet, or another application/process). * Control by some type of computer language and/or an expert system langauge + Programatic building of slides/cards. User Interface: --------------- * Given a set of slides/cards to author, in depth knowledge of computers should not be required (programmer support may be required for linking to other applications). --> Intuitive authoring interface. Programatic Support: -------------------- + For those features which are not commercially provided and must be programmed, the platform/software should provide development support for a rapid prototyping initiative. =============== From: pranav@unx.sas.com (Pranav Patel) Subject: SAS on NeXT demo at the next TUNG meeting Date: 25 Aug 91 03:17:54 GMT Sender: pranav@unx.sas.com (Pranav Patel) It seems my first attempt to post this failed. So if you get this by mistake forgive. The next Triangle Area Users of the NeXT Group (TUNG) meeting will be on august 27th(tuesday). The meeting will be hosted by SAS Institute in their Cary Headquarters. The Topic of the meeting will be a demonstration of SAS on the NeXT platform. The meeting will be at 6:30pm. The quard at the gate will direct you. If you have any questions please feel free to call me at 919-677-8000 ext 7545. I will include the following general directions to the Institute. >From chapel hill and durham. take I-40 EAST to raleigh. Get off on exit for Harrison Avenue(exit 287). Take a right at the exit. The next left at the stop light is SAS Institute. >From Raleigh take I-40 WEST to durham and chapel hill take the Harrison Avenue exit(exit 287). Take a left at the exit stop light. Cross the Bridge and the next left at the stop light is SAS Institute. thanks -pranav patel- Graphical User Interfaces Project Manager Open Systems Research & Development SAS Institute Inc. SAS Campus Drive Cary, NC 27513 pranav@sas.com envisage before you saltate. From: tybalt@milton.u.washington.edu (Prince of Cats) Subject: hex tool Summary: D**n BL cubes that don't come with the hex wrench Keywords: hex tool alternates Date: 26 Aug 91 01:43:00 GMT I love my NeXT, honestly I do, almost as much as my girlfriend (well, no, but ;))...anyhow, beings as I got my cube through the fire sale, I managed not to get a hex wrench with my cube...anybody know where in the hell to get one that will work? I tried 2 full sets of standard hex wrenches, none of which worked. How much (if it's possible) is it to order one from NeXT? Could a substitute be found elsewhere? I want to install my RAM!!! &^%&$*&**$#%!@#%!#$^$%^ Grrrr... Thanks for any info... :) From: mcdonald@cs.sfu.ca (Ken Mcdonald) Subject: Network updating problem on NeXT Date: 25 Aug 91 22:38:03 GMT I'm currently doing som programmin in Common LISP on a Next--I write the code at home on my mac, upload it to a SUN (because I have a Zmodem binary for the Sun, but not for the NeXT), and then login on the NeXT to actually run and debug the code. Since the Sun and NeXT are networked together, this shouldn't cause problems, but in fact the NeXT sometimes doesn't become aware of the new, just-uploaded file for a very long time-- which can be quite annoying, and wastes a lot of my time. I've been told this is due to a caching problem with the NeXT, but the person who told me this didn't have any suggestion for fixing the problem. Anyone out there who can help? Thanks in advance, Ken McDonald mcdonald@cs.sfu.ca From: daugher@cs.tamu.edu (Walter C. Daugherity) Subject: Re: hex tool Keywords: NeXT hex tool Date: 26 Aug 91 15:42:47 GMT References: <1991Aug26.014300.11761@milton.u.washington.edu> Sender: usenet@helios.TAMU.EDU In article <1991Aug26.014300.11761@milton.u.washington.edu> tybalt@milton.u.washington.edu (Prince of Cats) asks where to get a hex tool (for removing the back panel to install more RAM, etc.). Reading the Friendly Manual, Appendix C of the User's Reference says "you can buy another one from your Authorized NeXT Service Center or use a three-millimeter ball-tipped hex wrench, which can be bought at a hardware store." P.S. I am posting this reply to comp.sys.next as well as comp.sys.next.misc for the benefit of the original poster. From: doug@foxtrot (Douglas Scott) Subject: Re: XNeXT: what's wrong, X or NeXT ?, (or me :^) Date: 26 Aug 91 17:32:22 GMT References: <1838@saltillo.cs.utexas.edu> Sender: root@ucsbcsl.ucsb.edu In article <1838@saltillo.cs.utexas.edu> cpg@cs.utexas.edu (Carlos M. Puchol) writes: > I am running version 2.0 of the Operating System. > > When I try to run any binary Xapplication in the station, (even with DISPLAY set to a > machine running X (R4)) I get: > > > X Toolkit Error: Can't Open display > > 0) I don't know much about X, but as I understand from the README file > I think need to instal the X R3 server in the machine, is this right? Ouch. No. The R3 server (XNeXT) does not run on the 2.0 machine at all. Throw it and all its binaries, etc., away right now. > 1) Do I need to have X (R3) running in my box to be > able to diplay something run in the NeXT box in its display? First see above answer. Then, you need to run an X server of some sort on your machine to do anything with X. What is a "NeXT Box"? The X root window on the NeXT? > 2) Do I need to have X (R3) running in a remote machine to be > able to diplay something run in the NeXT box, in that remote machine's display? Have you worked with any form of X before? One of the basic principles is that you usually run the X server locally, but can run applications remotely. > 3) I am quite confused because the documentation with this release > of XNeXT is REALLY poor. Can anybody help me with this ? Dump it, and grab the newer version of the X server off of the Net somewhere (one of the NeXT archives). It is called Mouse-X. Everything in it is identical to a standard X11R4 release, except it has its own pre-compiled server, which has a couple of special tricks built in. There should be documentation with it. There is also a commercial X release out call CoXist, for around $400 I hear. -- Douglas Scott (805)893-8352 Center for Computer Music Research and Composition University of California, Santa Barbara Internet: (NeXTMail ok) From: root@next1.questor.wimsey.bc.ca (Operator) Subject: test Date: 26 Aug 91 21:28:49 GMT Sender: root@pkyn.wimsey.bc.ca (Operator) test From: mcoste@next.com (Michel Coste) Subject: Re: test--please ignore Date: 26 Aug 91 21:38:46 GMT References: <1991Aug13.005917.4800@balor.apple.com> Sender: news@NeXT.COM In article <1991Aug13.005917.4800@balor.apple.com> mikel@balor writes: > This is a test. > This is only a test. test too From: kari@finn (Kari Karhi) Subject: Re: XNeXT: what's wrong, X or NeXT ?, (or me :^) Date: 26 Aug 91 22:55:11 GMT References: <1233@ucsbcsl.ucsb.edu> Sender: usenet@pensoft.uucp (Usenet Psuedo User) In article <1233@ucsbcsl.ucsb.edu> doug@foxtrot (Douglas Scott) writes: > There is also a commercial X release out call CoXist, for around $400 I hear. > It's actually only about half of that. The above figure includes Motif and the documentation in Digital Librarian format. Sorry for the commercial, but I did not want to leave a wrong impression on anyone's mind. Kari Karhi Pencom Software (512)343-1111 From: terry@sonia.math.ucla.edu Subject: need recommendations for MIDI project Date: 27 Aug 91 02:39:34 GMT Sender: terry@MATH.UCLA.EDU Hi, everyone! I am soon to start on a programming project and am looking for a few recommendations for compilers, libraries, etc. The project will involve MIDI, the Musical Instrument Digital Interface. The main thing I need to do is "get and put music". For example, I would like to be able to read the signals coming in off a MIDI device (say, a keyboard) and display the notes being played. Target platforms (minimum configurations) will be: PC: 8 MHz XT, monochrome, 512K, hard disk Mac: SE, monochrome, 2 Mb, hard disk NeXT: well, the minimum NeXT should be sufficient 8-) The PC is the primary target. Right now, I expect to be developing in C++, given the popularity and portability of the language and number of third-party tools & libs available. So .... 1. Can anyone recommend a C++ compiler? After reading reviews, I am down to Borland: speed, lotsa tools, Windows support Zortech: speed, Mac, OS/2 and UNIX versions available JPI: multi-language support ... I don't know diddly about Mac and NeXT compilers ... 2. What are good references for MIDI standard? MIDI programming? 3. Are there standards for interfacing to MIDI cards? How many types of MIDI adapters are out there, anyway? Are they available on the Mac and NeXT? Will a box that plugs into a PC MIDI card work with one in a Mac? 4. According to _Computer Language_ mag, you can interface C++ with the MacApp libraries. Has anyone ever done this? Do you need a particular C++ compiler? 5. I could use libraries for Screen design General-purpose, high-speed graphics MIDI (may roll my own there) I am leaning towards the Zinc Interface lib for the PC. However, something supported on multiple platforms would be nice. Also, when you use a interface library, like Zinc, can you mix its graphics with stuff from a general-purpose library? For example, if I were writing a drawing program, I might use a interface lib to lay out the standard "sketchpad" with a top menu bar. I would then want to be able to use general-purpose routines to "draw" in the sketching area. I'm worried about the interface manager's "layers" or screens or viewports or whatever screwing me up, like forgetting to redraw my sketches when it redraws the screen for whatever reason. Is this a problem? Am I just being paranoid? Thanks for reading this long post. Please reply by e-mail, and I will send summaries to anyone interested and post the results to the net. Thanks again! Terry McKiernan terry@math.ucla.edu, terry@law.ucla.edu From: an602@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (James M. Bernatowicz) Subject: NeXT Brochure/Info Wanted Date: 27 Aug 91 06:15:22 GMT Sender: news@usenet.ins.cwru.edu Hello. I am evaluating my options for a new system. I'd really like a UNIX workstation, and somebody mentioned NeXT. I know nothing of these machines, (and little more about Suns.) If someone could please point me in the direction of a NeXT representative, I'd be most appreciative! I am located in Cleveland, OH but will be moving the The University of Michigan in Ann Arbor soon. I'd like to know prices, hardware "under the hood," and the selling points. In other words, the pros/cons of a NeXT workstation. What do you people use it for? (Besides posting test messages to comp.sys.next? :-) Thanks in advance, jmb From: dscy@eng.cam.ac.uk (D.S.C. Yap) Subject: Re: Network updating problem on NeXT Date: 27 Aug 91 03:22:15 GMT References: <1991Aug25.223803.19666@cs.sfu.ca> Sender: @eng.cam.ac.uk Try "touch"ing the file. Davin From: ravend!brian@netcomsv.netcom.com (Brian Caslis) Subject: Internal Drive for NeXTcube for sale Keywords: NeXT cube hard drive sale Date: 27 Aug 91 07:26:18 GMT Sender: news@ravend.uucp For Sale: Maxtor 8380S 340MB Full Height 5.25" Hard Drive. Used as an internal drive in a NeXTcube. Drive has performed flawlessly, I only need more space! Drive is best suited as an internal drive for a NeXTcube. An external case would be required for a NeXTstation. Price is $700 OBO. If interested please call (415)694-4189 or e-mail. --- Brian Caslis * NeXTmail accepted! * Internet: ravend!brian@netcomsv.netcom.com * or brianc@synopsys.com * UUCP: ...decwrl!apple!netcom!ravend!brian From: dweissman@amarna.gsfc.nasa.gov (WiseGuy) Subject: Re: XNeXT: what's wrong, X or NeXT ?, (or me :^) Date: 27 Aug 91 15:22:34 GMT References: <1233@ucsbcsl.ucsb.edu> <1991Aug26.225511.16733@pensoft.uucp> Sender: news@dftsrv.gsfc.nasa.gov News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.3-4 In article <1991Aug26.225511.16733@pensoft.uucp>, kari@finn (Kari Karhi) writes... ^In article <1233@ucsbcsl.ucsb.edu> doug@foxtrot (Douglas Scott) writes: ^> There is also a commercial X release out call CoXist, for around $400 I hear. ^> ^It's actually only about half of that. The above figure includes Motif and the ^documentation in Digital Librarian format. ^ ^Sorry for the commercial, but I did not want to leave a wrong impression on ^anyone's mind. Try about $350 with Motif and Digital Librarian. ================================================================================ Dave Weissman - Broadband and FDDI LAN Operations Group Snail mail: NSI DECNET (SPAN) - 6153::DWEISSMAN Code 543.8 NSI TCP/IP - dweissman@<128.183.112.2> Goddard Space Flight Center SPRINTnet's X.400 - Greenbelt, Maryland 20771 (C:USA,A:TELEMAIL,P:GSFC,FN:DAVID,SN:WEISSMAN) From: tmab+@andrew.cmu.edu (Thomas Mok) Subject: Alternative input device Date: 27 Aug 91 21:02:55 GMT Does anyone know whether there are commercial barcode readers that can be used as input devices for the NeXT? Tom Mok P.S. What are touch screen? From: jiro@shaman.com (Jiro Nakamura) Subject: Re: Connecting An Apple Scanner to a NeXT Date: 28 Aug 91 22:17:25 GMT Sender: daemon@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU Concerning connecting an Apple Scanner to the NeXT: 1) There were no set SCSI commands for controlling a scanner until SCSI-2. Most of the scanners on the market (Canon, Apple, HDB, etc.) use proprietary / incompatible commands for scanning. This causes problems for folks who want to scan. 2) The scanner object bundled with Scene only talks to HDB scanners and scanners that are OEMed from the same supplier (I forgot the name, I believe it was a german company). The chances of a random scanner having the same command set is pretty slim. 3) Most companies that sell scanners for the NeXT and Apple will sell you their software only, so that foiks who have previously purchased their machines for their Apples aren't left out. Of course, Apple Inc. does not produce such software for the NeXT machines. 4) The Shaman Group is currently working on the concept of scanner independence from a (non-scanner) developer's perspective. Eventually, we (or other people cooperating in our project) hope to support as many scanners as we can. But the project is currently still a sparkle in our minds, so don't expect it any time soon. - jiro nakamura jiro@shaman.com From: cs00jec@unccvax.uncc.edu (Jim Cain) Subject: Missing all discussions Keywords: arggh mad as fire Date: 28 Aug 91 22:50:01 GMT Well, we still don't get the new c.s.n groups. I've read *twelve* new messages in the last week. This really pisses me off, but I understand the reason, I suppose. When I asked when it would be looked into, I received the following: [from one admin:] Jim, I don't know. It won't be soon. We are very busy getting up 97 more Sun's and 5 more servers - and that's just in Engineering. News is a nice feature, but it is not something that Dean's and Chairmen demand to have going for their researchers. [sic, to death!] Oh, well. From: hschaffn@tsypac1.UUCP (Heinz Schaffner) Subject: NeXT Info Wanted Date: 28 Aug 91 12:47:32 GMT Hello: We are located in Toronto, Canada, and are looking for information on the location of a local (or close) NeXT distributor or reseller. Thanks in advance Heinz Schaffner ..!uunet!torsqnt!tsypac1!hschaffn From: francisr@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Rob Francis) Subject: Benchmarks on the fortran compiler? Date: 29 Aug 91 01:52:15 GMT Sender: news@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (USENET News System) Nntp-Posting-Host: silver.ucs.indiana.edu Does anyone have some benchmarks on the fortran compiler for the NeXT? I've gotten some replies from people like, "Faster than a XXX" or "Not as fast as a XXX", but I'd really like to get hold of some real numbers. Please reply via email. I'll post a summary if there's interest. Thanks in advance, Rob Rob Francis francisr@indiana.edu From: jcr@milton.u.washington.edu (Jeff Fire) Subject: How Can I Restart/Reset-From-FIle Workspace Without Loging Out (for me account) Date: 29 Aug 91 01:57:08 GMT Sender: news@milton.u.washington.edu (News) I use a "me" account that won't save Workspace settings (i.e. Dock & File Viewer settings). All I have is a permanent directory. Can I restart the Workspace without loging out? Can I reset the Workspace via a file (not interactively)? Can "Edit" record and play back commands (via recorder or macros)? Can "Edit" select a "box" of text (i.e. select certain columns and rows via mouse)? Pleas e-mail me if you have any info. From: slp@genrad.uucp (Stephen L. Peters) Subject: Re: Missing all discussions Keywords: arggh mad as fire Date: 29 Aug 91 19:06:18 GMT References: <3657@unccvax.uncc.edu> Sender: news@genrad.UUCP In article <3657@unccvax.uncc.edu> cs00jec@unccvax.uncc.edu (Jim Cain) writes: [note from his sysadmins saying, in effect, that they're too busy to trifle with News] Well, pardon my flamage, but I think this is really stupid. If you're not going to administer your news system then *what's the point of being a news administrator*??? The add date for the new groups was July 7 -- over 7 weeks ago!!! How much further behind are they? Since that time 22 other groups have been created in non-alternate hierarchies alone. In my humble opinion, being a news administrator is *not* a full-time job, especially if the system is more or less already set up. However, if you let the backlog get to be too big, it will become a major undertaking. No matter what the "Deans and Chairmen" want, the thing that matters most in any administration is upkeep. 97 Suns and five servers later, the news problem will still be huge, and then it will be put off because of problems with the new machines (I'm willing to place a small wager on this). I don't know what kind of setup your school (or business?) has, but if they have the budget (they should, 97 Suns don't come cheap), they should try getting a student or someone to become a part-time news administrator. The main sysadmins get the time they need to work, and the news users get service. Everyone is happy. Sorry. I may not know the entire situation, but this kind of procrastination on the part of the admins bugs me. "Brutus assassinated Caesar, what, 2000 years ago? | And here's a high-school dropout with a $1.25 an | Stephen Peters hour job in Dallas, Texas who knows who he was. | slp@genrad.com And they say fame is fleeting." -- JWB, _Assassins_ | From: paladin@en.ecn.purdue.edu (Robert Wen) Subject: Cube prices Date: 29 Aug 91 22:43:55 GMT Sender: paladin@en.ecn.purdue.edu (Robert Wen) Hi netters!! I'm interested in obtaining a Nextcube and am interested in seeing what prices and educational discounts are like at other places. Actually, I wouldn't mind an 030 cube either (hint, hint). If anybody could post or e-mail any information it would be greatly appreciated. From: an602@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (James M. Bernatowicz) Subject: Re: Cube prices Date: 30 Aug 91 03:51:08 GMT References: <1991Aug29.224355.29948@en.ecn.purdue.edu> Sender: news@usenet.ins.cwru.edu Nntp-Posting-Host: cwns1.ins.cwru.edu In a previous article, paladin@en.ecn.purdue.edu (Robert Wen) says: >Hi netters!! > I'm interested in obtaining a Nextcube and am interested in seeing >what prices and educational discounts are like at other places. >Actually, I wouldn't mind an 030 cube either (hint, hint). If anybody could >post or e-mail any information it would be greatly appreciated. Please post those replies! I'd like to see that info also. Thanks! From: blakemor@software.org (Alex Blakemore) Subject: looking for Ada compilers on the NeXT horizon Summary: Is anyone planning on releasing an Ada compiler for NeXT ? Keywords: Ada NeXT Date: 30 Aug 91 15:31:15 GMT Does anyone know of existing or planned Ada compilers for the NeXT ? I remember some literature that claimed Janus was planning a NeXT version. From: dar@reef.cis.ufl.edu (David Risler) Subject: Re: Cube prices Date: 30 Aug 91 16:22:19 GMT References: <1991Aug29.224355.29948@en.ecn.purdue.edu> <1991Aug30.035108.607@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> Sender: news@uflorida.cis.ufl.EDU John from ufl.nerdc sent me this number for NeXT educational discount prices. They are still working off the Spring '91 prices, but they should decrease and the new list is due out sometime October (according to annonymous tip form guy at NeXT). Here it is: 1-800-848-NEXT. From: baldwa@ondine.adobe.com (Sanjay Baldwa) Subject: Need and implementation of malloc_size() Date: 29 Aug 91 21:12:32 GMT Sender: news@adobe.COM Hi, Could somebody mail me an implementation of malloc_size()? as in the malloc(3) family of functions. We are in a process of moving to another system and malloc(3) library doesn't have malloc_size(). Thanks, Sanjay -- baldwa@adobe.com or ..!decwrl!adobe!baldwa From: jncs@uno.edu Subject: Re: looking for Ada compilers on the NeXT horizon Date: 30 Aug 91 20:00:07 GMT References: <1991Aug30.153115.11720@software.org> Sender: news@cs.tulane.edu In article <1991Aug30.153115.11720@software.org>, blakemor@software.org (Alex Blakemore) writes: > > Does anyone know of existing or planned Ada compilers for the NeXT ? A Meridian representative called me this week to let me know the existance of Ada for the NeXT; her name is Linda Souza. (714) 727-0700. Ext 224. Jaime Nino Computer Science Department University of New Orleans From: baldwa@ondine.adobe.com (Sanjay Baldwa) Subject: Need and implementation of malloc_size() Date: 29 Aug 91 21:04:21 GMT Sender: news@adobe.COM Hi, Could somebody mail me an implementation of malloc_size()? as in the malloc(3) family of functions. We are in a process of moving to another system and malloc(3) library doesn't have malloc_size(). Thanks, Sanjay -- baldwa@adobe.com or ..!decwrl!adobe!baldwa From: an602@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (James M. Bernatowicz) Subject: 24 Pin Matrix Printer on a NeXT? Date: 31 Aug 91 00:12:58 GMT Sender: news@usenet.ins.cwru.edu Nntp-Posting-Host: cwns1.ins.cwru.edu I suspect the answer is no, but I thought I'd ask. I have an NEC P5200 24 pin dot matrix printer, and I'd like to know if I would be able to use it if I bought a NeXT. Is there is a parallel port on the NeXT? Are there ANY other printing alternatives? Thanks! Jim From: labb-4ea@e260-3d.berkeley.edu Subject: When will we be getting the software!!!!! Date: 31 Aug 91 05:24:21 GMT Sender: usenet@agate.berkeley.edu (USENET Administrator) Originator: labb-4ea@e260-3d.berkeley.edu I have purchased a NeXT in early January from the University of California at Berkeley. After patiently waited for three months, the machine finally arrived in the middle of march. However, the machine does not include mathematica, nor does deliever the NeXTStep software which I have orderd along with the computer. So far, the machine is sitting on desk does nothing, since I have intended to use it for programming and number crunching purpose, and I have neither the mathematica nor the NeXTStep software. Does anyone who purchases the NeXT computer actually be able to get hold of NeXTStep release 2.1, or the mathematica? If not, does anyone has any vague idea of how soon that we will be able to receive the software? I have pressed the computer store for a defnite deadline for receiving the software, but all they can tell me is we can only deliver what the NeXT Inc. send to us. Reply please send to stevek@corwin.barra.com From: perstoro@netmbx.UUCP (Wilhelm Schaefer) Subject: Re: 24 Pin Matrix Printer on a NeXT? Date: 31 Aug 91 09:21:05 GMT References: <1991Aug31.001258.1928@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> an602@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (James M. Bernatowicz) writes: >I suspect the answer is no, but I thought I'd ask. I have an NEC P5200 >24 pin dot matrix printer, and I'd like to know if I would be able to use >it if I bought a NeXT. Is there is a parallel port on the NeXT? >Are there ANY other printing alternatives? Yes and no. I heard from a program that makes the NeXT able to print with a nec 2200. And there will be some other drivers, soon! Also it is possible to put a parallel-interface on you scsi-port. On the other hand, the NeXT printer is not that expencive, but it is much better than any pinwriter. so long perstoro ***************************************************************** * perstoro@netmbx.in-berlin.de | NeXT mail is *very* welcome! * * perstoro@opal.cs.tu-berlin.de | * ***************************************************************** From: atau@ccrma.Stanford.edu (Atau Tanaka) Subject: Re: need recommendations for MIDI project Date: 31 Aug 91 21:45:56 GMT References: <1991Aug27.023934.21056@math.ucla.edu> Sender: news@leland.Stanford.EDU (Mr News) terry@sonia.math.ucla.edu writes > I am soon to start on a programming project and am looking for a few > recommendations for compilers, libraries, etc. > > 2. What are good references for > > MIDI standard? > MIDI programming? > > 3. Are there standards for interfacing to MIDI cards? How many types of > MIDI adapters are out there, anyway? Are they available on the Mac and > NeXT? Will a box that plugs into a PC MIDI card work with one in a Mac? > The International MIDI Association (IMA) is the main clearinghouse for obtaining the MIDI Specification. They're right in LA, so you can look them up. Let me know if you can't, and I'll dig up the number. On the Mac, it seems as though most MIDI programmers use the Think C compiler. As for MIDI interfaces, the NeXT and Mac serial ports are nearly compatible - Opcode and others make interfaces that work in both (watch out, with NeXT's 040 motherboards, serial ports A and B are not the same, and Mac MIDI interfaces seem to work in serial B). There are software MIDI drivers available online for the NeXT, and from Opcode or Apple for the Mac (Opcode MIDI System and MIDI Manager, respectively). You really ought to check out the state of the art of what's already available out there in the commercial MIDI software world. Opcode and Mark of the Unicorn and Passport are good places to start with the Mac, and Mike McNabb's "Ensemble" is an example that ships with the next. Atau Tanaka From: atau@ccrma.Stanford.edu (Atau Tanaka) Subject: Terminal menubar Keywords: shell, preference Date: 31 Aug 91 21:51:42 GMT Sender: news@leland.Stanford.EDU (Mr News) Here's a how-come: How come Terminal is the only program that refuses to place its menubar where you've told the Prefs app to put menubars? I've got my menubars placed over on the right hand side of my screen so as to free up valuable real estate in the upper left hand corner. Every app accedes to this except Terminal. Also, cmn3 still doesn't register with People. Even when I'm on, running People shows "nobody" on cmn3. Should I take this personally? Atau Tanaka , atau@ccrma.stanford.edu