This is signal-noise-ratio-on-comp.sys.next in view mode; [Up]
Date: Sun 14-Apr-1989 21:09:37 From: Unknown Subject: signal/noise ratio on comp.sys.next As someone who is doing serious native-mode (Application Kit) NeXT programming and interested in exchanging technical information, I'm more than a little bit distressed by the poor signal/noise ratio on this list. Some of the worst offenders appear to be individuals who have never even seen a NeXT. Some flames are worthwhile. The source code issue, comments about various design issues [e.g. power button, making the mouse right button useful, etc.] are of concern to all of us. The attributes of toy computers such as the Amiga or Atari ST (or even Macintosh) are not. Nor, really, are the comments about whether or not a NeXT is worth buying. That is a matter between you, your moneybags, and NeXT. If you love your Amiga I am very happy for you. Now, to put some signal into this noisy message: I am *still* trying to figure out how in an NX_LISTMODE matrix how to programmatically get the effect of COMMAND/LEFT-MOUSE on a matrix item (that is, *add* it to the selected items instead of making it the only selected item). Merely calling highlightCellAt::lit: visually does the right thing, but leads to bizarre effects when you try selection modification via the mouse. More specifically, what I have is a matrix of ButtonCells inside of a scrolling view. I can have any number of those cells selected. I want to do so by program control (e.g. call a subroutine that will 'select item #23') or by the mouse (via LEFT-MOUSE, SHIFT/LEFT-MOUSE, or COMMAND/LEFT-MOUSE...damn it, give me the goddamn right button!!). I want LEFT-MOUSE on a single item to clear any previous selection (which it does normally, but not if you highlighted various items by program control). How can I do this? Or, what else do I do besides highlighting to make sure the list mode matrix knows that I've done this to some other cells? -- Mark -- Mark Crispin / P.O. Box 2652 / Seattle, WA 98111-2652 / (206) 842-2385 mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU / MRC@WSMR-SIMTEL20.Army.Mil 450cc Rebel pilot -- a step up from 250cc's!!! kisha no kisha ga kisha de kisha-shita...tabesaserarenakerebanaranakattarashii >From: jgreely@cis.ohio-state.edu (J Greely)
Date: Sun 15-Apr-1989 08:17:35 From: Unknown Subject: Re: signal/noise ratio on comp.sys.next In article <1586@blake.acs.washington.edu> Mark Crispin <mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU> writes: > As someone who is doing serious native-mode (Application Kit) >NeXT programming and interested in exchanging technical information, >I'm more than a little bit distressed by the poor signal/noise ratio >on this list. Some of the worst offenders appear to be individuals >who have never even seen a NeXT. "Offenders"? Lighten up! Most of your complaints come completely from left field ("you live in your reality, I'll live in mine"). A quick check shows that this group is supposed to be for "discussion about the NeXT computer". *Not* technical issues, "discussion". All of the things you take offense at are at least tangentially related to the machine, and as such are best discussed here. If you feel that the technical content of this group is too low, raise it. Don't tell people to "either post techie stuff or shut up". I, for one, find that (excuse me, *this*) sort of article to be pure noise, no matter what else you put into it. > Some flames are worthwhile. ...defined as those that are worthwhile to *you*, I see. > The attributes of >toy computers such as the Amiga or Atari ST (or even Macintosh) are >not. Consider, if you will, that many of the people who are interested in the NeXT are coming from this camp, it is quite relevant ("can it do MIDI? can it do this better? can it handle french fries?"). Not too many people have actually had the chance to work with a NeXT, and they *have* to compare them to something they're familiar with. For many of the cube's features, that's the Amiga/Mac/ST market. >Nor, really, are the comments about whether or not a NeXT is >worth buying. <snicker> Yeah, and I suppose you've got a bridge stashed away somewhere cheap. In a forum for discussing the system, the issue of whether it's worth buying is not appropriate? Things like pricing structure, availability of application software, competition, and performance are *useless*, huh? We need a haven for frustrated NeXTStep programmers, yessir. 'Scuse me while I laugh hysterically. >That is a matter between you, your moneybags, and NeXT. Not on your life. If I'm looking at a machine, I don't want slick corporate paper, I want to hear from people who are *using* it. I *want* the information you find so useless. Does it work as promised? Is it reliable? How easy was learning the interface for a normal Unix user? an X-lover? a DOS addict? a MacPerson? a random person you pulled off the street? How well are they packaged? How is the support? How good/bad is the optical drive? How well does it drop into a heterogenous network environment? Can I run it as a Yp client subnetted under a Sun 3/160 running SunOS 3.5? How good is the net-boot software in practice? How stable is the NFS implementation? Is it safe to let my network trust one? Does Jot really crash if you breath hard? Will Carol marry John, or will David blackmail her with the pictures? (Yes, I know the answers to most of these questions, so don't send them to me, unless you know where I can get the pictures. Cheap). >If you love your Amiga I am very happy for you. I don't have one. I have owned several machines, and currently use an AT for a home terminal (and suns for most else). I have a Mac-Plus and a NeXT on my desk, and the next time I buy a home machine, it will be at least of the caliber of a NeXT (although I admit to a certain fascination with raw speed, there are some features to a cube that I would be willing to give up a few MIPS for). > Now, to put some signal into this noisy message: I am *still* >trying to figure out how in an NX_LISTMODE matrix how to >programmatically get the effect of COMMAND/LEFT-MOUSE on a matrix item >(that is, *add* it to the selected items instead of making it the only >selected item). Merely calling highlightCellAt::lit: visually does >the right thing, but leads to bizarre effects when you try selection >modification via the mouse. Please stop cluttering this newsgroup with annoying messages like this. All it does is server to distract people from the important issues of rehashing market placement and competition. (NOTE: Yes, I *am* half-kidding. I don't consider this question useless, but it has no direct effect on my use of my NeXT. I don't have *time* to devote to digging into NeXT-specific programming yet, and likely won't for some time.)
These are the contents of the former NiCE NeXT User Group NeXTSTEP/OpenStep software archive, currently hosted by Marcel Waldvogel and Netfuture.ch.